Posted Nov 02, 2007 at 05:59AM by David T.
Listed in:
News,
Games,
Manhunt 2
Tags:
ESRB,
PS2,
Timothy Winter
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Unless the industry as a whole, including the ESRB, steps up to the plate immediately and decisively, there is little doubt the video game ratings system will face the specter of government oversight. |
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[Via GamePolitics.com]
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20 Comments
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by JOshISPoser - 2007-11-02 |
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» esrb
why can't they be left alone. their job is to rate games according to violence, gore, profanity, etc. and that's what they did with this game. They aren't made to try to modify the game to change the ratings. Apparently, these peoples don't believe in the constitution and that man is generally good (the people against ESRB). They believe right now that everyone is going to use this mod that isn't part of the game, you have to edit the game. Why rate something that's not part of a game?
why can't they be left alone. their job is to rate games according to violence, gore, profanity, etc. and that's what they did with this game. They aren't made to try to modify the game to change the ratings. Apparently, these peoples don't believe in the constitution and that man is generally good (the people against ESRB). They believe right now that everyone is going to use this mod that isn't part of the game, you have to edit the game. Why rate something that's not part of a game?
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by Just_a_guy - 2007-11-02 |
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» the problem
here's the problem: how is it that movies like Saw are aloud to be shown as "R" yet games like manhunt 2, which has the same level of violence as Saw (the old pre modified version) get screamed at for having that level of violence?
here's the problem: how is it that movies like Saw are aloud to be shown as "R" yet games like manhunt 2, which has the same level of violence as Saw (the old pre modified version) get screamed at for having that level of violence?
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Re: Binary - 2007-11-02 |
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» I agree
Why they not *****ing about violence in movies?
...If violence allow on movies, so can Manhunt 2 + other games.
Why they not *****ing about violence in movies?
...If violence allow on movies, so can Manhunt 2 + other games.
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Re: iamback(unregistered) - 2007-11-02 |
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» hypothesis
My hypothesis is that the goons are gonna say that Saw is "watching" a "murder", while the games themselves are "training simulations". At least that's how I see their standpoint as being.
My hypothesis is that the goons are gonna say that Saw is "watching" a "murder", while the games themselves are "training simulations". At least that's how I see their standpoint as being.
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by Torch - 2007-11-02 |
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» ..
All these guys are just stroking their *****es. Because nobody cares if they speak out against a movie, but people seem to listen when they speak about games.
All these guys are just stroking their *****es. Because nobody cares if they speak out against a movie, but people seem to listen when they speak about games.
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Re: Torch - 2007-11-02 |
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» ..
People presume that games are for kids, and movies are for adults, so movies aren't questioned or scrutinized.
People presume that games are for kids, and movies are for adults, so movies aren't questioned or scrutinized.
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by Keith K - 2007-11-02 |
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» US only problem
The ESRB is an international organization rating games for more than the United States.. There hasnt been any kind of backlash against them from within Canada or Mexico.. Why should the ESRB cater to the the self-indulgent sensationalists in the US?
You havent heard any backlash from within Canada.. and you're not going to convince me that Canada suffers from more violent crime for being "lenient" on violent media..
The fact is here we deal with criminals (although poorly).. We dont deal with scapegoats..
I could list the fundamental problems with the US government, constitution and attitude that allow such BS to perpetuate day after day, month after month, year after year... Unfortunately I only have 2 hours left here at work..
The ESRB is an international organization rating games for more than the United States.. There hasnt been any kind of backlash against them from within Canada or Mexico.. Why should the ESRB cater to the the self-indulgent sensationalists in the US?
You havent heard any backlash from within Canada.. and you're not going to convince me that Canada suffers from more violent crime for being "lenient" on violent media..
The fact is here we deal with criminals (although poorly).. We dont deal with scapegoats..
I could list the fundamental problems with the US government, constitution and attitude that allow such BS to perpetuate day after day, month after month, year after year... Unfortunately I only have 2 hours left here at work..
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Re: Billie - 2007-11-02 |
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» question
Is it safe to assume you are Canadian? Because if you are, your argument seems to be directed toward american government rather than the actual issue of Manhunt 2, and should probably discarded.
Is it safe to assume you are Canadian? Because if you are, your argument seems to be directed toward american government rather than the actual issue of Manhunt 2, and should probably discarded.
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Re: iamback(unregistered) - 2007-11-02 |
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» actually
I have to agree with Keith (heh heh... that name reminds me of Banded Keith from Yugioh the Abdridged series... from America!)... I myself am an American, and took no offense to what he said, because frankly, it's all true!
Canada is a bit of a pacifist country, but then again, isn't that a good thing? I'd rather support a country that thrives on justice, than one that thinks that a country's superiority is based on "how well they can blow up another country"...
So, since who we're talking about is America, and how they're trying to attack games, Keith attacking the US is NOT an ad hominem attack, since America IS the issue that's being dealt with. Furthermore, he is clearly stating the harms and is within the limits of topicality. (And yes, I am on the debate team if anyone's wondering... though admittedly I'm not very good :P)
I have to agree with Keith (heh heh... that name reminds me of Banded Keith from Yugioh the Abdridged series... from America!)... I myself am an American, and took no offense to what he said, because frankly, it's all true!
Canada is a bit of a pacifist country, but then again, isn't that a good thing? I'd rather support a country that thrives on justice, than one that thinks that a country's superiority is based on "how well they can blow up another country"...
So, since who we're talking about is America, and how they're trying to attack games, Keith attacking the US is NOT an ad hominem attack, since America IS the issue that's being dealt with. Furthermore, he is clearly stating the harms and is within the limits of topicality. (And yes, I am on the debate team if anyone's wondering... though admittedly I'm not very good :P)
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Re: Billie - 2007-11-02 |
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» to iamback
I am no way offended by what Keith had to say, and yes I also agree with his argument that ESRB is receiving backlash unfairly. But the problem that I have with his argument was his last sentence:
"I could list the fundamental problems with the US government, constitution and attitude that allow such BS to perpetuate day after day, month after month, year after year... Unfortunately I only have 2 hours left here at work.."
This has nothing to do with the fact that the ESRB is being attached publicly by a few overbearing groups. Also, stating that Canada is a pacifist country also has nothing to do with this ESRB backlash. When we bring up such irrelevant information to an argument, the posts end up becoming "My country is better than yours" comments only.
Also when you say that "America IS the issue" you are implying that America as a collective are the problem, when we know for a fact that this just a select group of "Americans". I myself am American and do not agree with what these groups are trying to accomplish, so does that mean that I am not American? Also from what I understand the UK doesn't think very highly of the ESRB either, that's why they have their own rating standards, so then again how is it an "American" only problem.
Again, I%u2019m glad that we can discuss these issues as mature adults, just like we should be able to play this game as mature adults as well!
I am no way offended by what Keith had to say, and yes I also agree with his argument that ESRB is receiving backlash unfairly. But the problem that I have with his argument was his last sentence:
"I could list the fundamental problems with the US government, constitution and attitude that allow such BS to perpetuate day after day, month after month, year after year... Unfortunately I only have 2 hours left here at work.."
This has nothing to do with the fact that the ESRB is being attached publicly by a few overbearing groups. Also, stating that Canada is a pacifist country also has nothing to do with this ESRB backlash. When we bring up such irrelevant information to an argument, the posts end up becoming "My country is better than yours" comments only.
Also when you say that "America IS the issue" you are implying that America as a collective are the problem, when we know for a fact that this just a select group of "Americans". I myself am American and do not agree with what these groups are trying to accomplish, so does that mean that I am not American? Also from what I understand the UK doesn't think very highly of the ESRB either, that's why they have their own rating standards, so then again how is it an "American" only problem.
Again, I%u2019m glad that we can discuss these issues as mature adults, just like we should be able to play this game as mature adults as well!
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by Billie - 2007-11-02 |
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» pssh
This is just completely ludacris. Manhunt 2 is on the shelves, these groups just need to deal with it. It actually amazes me that these "groups" still don't know what was edited out. All it takes is a google search, or a game review to explain just how "neutered" this game really is. I myself have written countless posts explaining how executions cannot even be shown to the player, even if the player is a 30 year old adult. I'm thirty, why can't I see them? I can't because some organizations think they know what's good for me and my family.
I've also said this before, but it's all politics. I seriously doubt that they really care this much about this controversy, but rather just want to make a name for themselves. Think about it, if Tim Winter gets majority of older American voters to agree with him on this subject, who's to say that he wouldn't get similar support if he ran for presidency. Think about how nobody even knew who Jack Thompson really was until he started his campaigning against music/movies/games.
Ultimately in the end, this talk of banning and censoring will only create a higher demand for the game itself. "Uh oh, I better hurry and buy a copy before it gets a Adults Only rating, and gets taken off the shelves". This is really sad considering this game isn't even all that great. It actually doesn't bring anything new gaming. If all these groups would have just kept to themselves, I am willing to bet this game wouldn't be the hit it is today.
This is just completely ludacris. Manhunt 2 is on the shelves, these groups just need to deal with it. It actually amazes me that these "groups" still don't know what was edited out. All it takes is a google search, or a game review to explain just how "neutered" this game really is. I myself have written countless posts explaining how executions cannot even be shown to the player, even if the player is a 30 year old adult. I'm thirty, why can't I see them? I can't because some organizations think they know what's good for me and my family.
I've also said this before, but it's all politics. I seriously doubt that they really care this much about this controversy, but rather just want to make a name for themselves. Think about it, if Tim Winter gets majority of older American voters to agree with him on this subject, who's to say that he wouldn't get similar support if he ran for presidency. Think about how nobody even knew who Jack Thompson really was until he started his campaigning against music/movies/games.
Ultimately in the end, this talk of banning and censoring will only create a higher demand for the game itself. "Uh oh, I better hurry and buy a copy before it gets a Adults Only rating, and gets taken off the shelves". This is really sad considering this game isn't even all that great. It actually doesn't bring anything new gaming. If all these groups would have just kept to themselves, I am willing to bet this game wouldn't be the hit it is today.
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Re: FreePlay - 2007-11-02 |
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» the word
is LUDICROUS.
is LUDICROUS.
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Re: Billie - 2007-11-02 |
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» Humor
Yes it is spelled Ludicrous, but I chose to use the "rappers" spelling instead +). I'm glad that somebody seen that.
Yes it is spelled Ludicrous, but I chose to use the "rappers" spelling instead +). I'm glad that somebody seen that.
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by cory1492 - 2007-11-02 |
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» ...
Unfortunately said groups of folks are blaming things on rockstar and such. I guess these days the TV, video games and internet are the ones to raise children and thus the makers of the content (even after end user modification) get the blame :(
I know, if I put cyanide in my pizza and get sick because of it, I should be able to make the pizza company go out of business for poisoning food xD
Unfortunately said groups of folks are blaming things on rockstar and such. I guess these days the TV, video games and internet are the ones to raise children and thus the makers of the content (even after end user modification) get the blame :(
I know, if I put cyanide in my pizza and get sick because of it, I should be able to make the pizza company go out of business for poisoning food xD
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by Chewieshmoo - 2007-11-02 |
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» Whatever......
The thing is the PTC aren't in any position to "Demand"
*****..................all these groups are just looking for attention by shooting their mouths off on a current hot topic that they really know nothing about or understand, they are all jumping on the bandwagon
for attention "Save the Children! Oh god won't somebody thing of the children?!!!" Ah yeah, it's called
good parenting, explaining and supervising, look into it people.................
The thing is the PTC aren't in any position to "Demand"
*****..................all these groups are just looking for attention by shooting their mouths off on a current hot topic that they really know nothing about or understand, they are all jumping on the bandwagon
for attention "Save the Children! Oh god won't somebody thing of the children?!!!" Ah yeah, it's called
good parenting, explaining and supervising, look into it people.................
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by AzumiUehara - 2007-11-02 |
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» how dumb are they?
this is so dumb... music, movies, and books are all worse then video games yet all they have to do is slap a parantal warning sticker on it and they can release whatever.... the whole esrb ratings system is out-dated anynow... in 24 and my generation grew up playing video games... im about sick of kids games like mario and stuff.. so why cant we have adult only games? as old as i am they still have to tell me what i can see and what i cant? i thought we had freedom of speech and all that... turns out we dont have freedom of speech after all... at least not for video games which to me is just another form of media.. to me video games is the next logical media type, its a mixture of writing, music and movies so why does each separate part need no censor but when you put them together and make a game it has to be censored so people dont see... Wheres jack thompson campaigning against rappers for talking about shooting people and selling drugs? wheres he at when in hostel the same type stuff happens as in manhunt?
this is so dumb... music, movies, and books are all worse then video games yet all they have to do is slap a parantal warning sticker on it and they can release whatever.... the whole esrb ratings system is out-dated anynow... in 24 and my generation grew up playing video games... im about sick of kids games like mario and stuff.. so why cant we have adult only games? as old as i am they still have to tell me what i can see and what i cant? i thought we had freedom of speech and all that... turns out we dont have freedom of speech after all... at least not for video games which to me is just another form of media.. to me video games is the next logical media type, its a mixture of writing, music and movies so why does each separate part need no censor but when you put them together and make a game it has to be censored so people dont see... Wheres jack thompson campaigning against rappers for talking about shooting people and selling drugs? wheres he at when in hostel the same type stuff happens as in manhunt?
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by Chw42 - 2007-11-02 |
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» OH god....
ATTENTION ALL SOCCER MOMS:
Rockstar Games is likely to host a league where children of all ages can play soccer AT ALL TIMES OF YEAR, so your asses would be out of the way to make the world a more peaceful and evidently...a better place.
Please...play one of these games and get some real info, listening to that idiot Jack Thompson gets you nothing. Stop believing what that retard says, he's not correct. And if I'm not mistaken, he probably never picked up a video game in the first place...he just decided to hate it. Like how Hitler disliked Jewish people...you can call this all-out attempt to screw Rockstar...well a video game holocaust. That's right a Holocaust.
ATTENTION ALL SOCCER MOMS:
Rockstar Games is likely to host a league where children of all ages can play soccer AT ALL TIMES OF YEAR, so your asses would be out of the way to make the world a more peaceful and evidently...a better place.
Please...play one of these games and get some real info, listening to that idiot Jack Thompson gets you nothing. Stop believing what that retard says, he's not correct. And if I'm not mistaken, he probably never picked up a video game in the first place...he just decided to hate it. Like how Hitler disliked Jewish people...you can call this all-out attempt to screw Rockstar...well a video game holocaust. That's right a Holocaust.
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by Dodo - 2007-11-02 |
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» Ugh
These treehugging crackheads need to shut the F**K UP! Leave Manhunt 2 and ESRB alone! Gamers need to protest against this nonsense and protect our freedom to play whatever we choose.
These treehugging crackheads need to shut the F**K UP! Leave Manhunt 2 and ESRB alone! Gamers need to protest against this nonsense and protect our freedom to play whatever we choose.
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by YAMI ANUBIS X - 2007-11-02 |
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» I bet its JACK THOMPSON, THE EVIL ONE!
He hates Take Two and Rockstar so freaking much that he has corrupted everyone into doing this with Manhunt 2.
I mean ever since september 11th 2001, everyone is like this, they think everything is either TERRORISTS OR TRAINING SIMULATIONS AKA KILLING SIMULATIONS!
Do you guys remember how a woman thought that people that talked in muslim thought that they were terrorists trying to bomb america and such and the muslim kids were just kids from College and she made it seem like it was a threat and the whole state was quarantined till the kids were found.
USA is super paranoid these days, all because of BUSH!
Anyway thats the story about Manhunt 2.
He hates Take Two and Rockstar so freaking much that he has corrupted everyone into doing this with Manhunt 2.
I mean ever since september 11th 2001, everyone is like this, they think everything is either TERRORISTS OR TRAINING SIMULATIONS AKA KILLING SIMULATIONS!
Do you guys remember how a woman thought that people that talked in muslim thought that they were terrorists trying to bomb america and such and the muslim kids were just kids from College and she made it seem like it was a threat and the whole state was quarantined till the kids were found.
USA is super paranoid these days, all because of BUSH!
Anyway thats the story about Manhunt 2.
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by David T. (Unregistered) - 2007-11-03 |
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» re:
I guess people are looking for a convenient target for their anger. Look at what happened after the Columbine incident...
I guess people are looking for a convenient target for their anger. Look at what happened after the Columbine incident...
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